Jun 24 2008
I just used my last squirt of Heinz
Why the need to shove this in our faces? What people do behind the scenes is one thing. Obviously they have right to make the commercials they want. But I have the right to buy Del Monte instead of Heinz too. This is in the UK but I’ll bet this will be in the US before long.
What do you think?
47 responses so far
I think you have the right to do whatever you want, but also that there are many things that just aren’t worth the trouble of worrying about.
Texas in Africa’s last blog post..edwards for vp? update
TIA,
Your entitled to your opinion. The deterioration of marriage is what caused many societies to crumble.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..I just used my last squirt of Heinz
Funny, or is that sad, how satan uses humor to desensitize us to what was in that video! Children calling him “Mum” and the husband kissing him on the lips.
I’m with you Kevin. There are too many choices out there. I’ll chose another brand!
M. Steve Heartsill’s last blog post..Unappreciated Police Help
I like Red Gold ketchup better anyway. Made in Indiana from Indiana tomatoes. The commercial? Sick. BTW: isn’t John Kerry? nah never mind.
Bill(cycleguy)’s last blog post..An Example of God’s Work
What???????? That’s a stupid / weird commercial not just offensive. I can’t believe this is running anywhere. They have to offend more people than this commercial’s target group - even in England. I bet this even offends the gay community somehow.
Can I just boycott the Mayo that’s in the commercial? Because I really like their ketchup. Although we usually just buy the generic.
I was wondering where that commercial was going.
For the record, I can’t ditch the Heinz. It’s just too yummy and I’m too much of a ketchup junkie to go without.
Michael’s last blog post..Ecclesiastes Chapters 3 - 5 : Turn, Turn, Turn
Michael, after reading some of your posts, I have a question for you. Is there anything that would cause you to go without something? Is there any line you would draw in the sand?
M. Steve Heartsill’s last blog post..Unappreciated Police Help
Of course there is, but a ketchup commercial that airs in the UK is kind of a silly reason to go without. I mean where is the line drawn the other way? Do I not eat at Red Lobster if they have a gay waiter? Do I not shop at Old Navy if one of the workers is an atheist? Do I not drive a Chevy if some random guy in the assembly plant worships Satan?
Last I checked Jesus hung out with quite a few sinners. Who am I to stand up and declare them ro their products too sinful for me?
Michael’s last blog post..Ecclesiastes Chapters 3 - 5 : Turn, Turn, Turn
It looks like our faith is saved.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1028794/Heinz-mayonnaise-advert-men-kissing-set-complained-year.html
Michael,
I don’t care about an employee. But when a company goes out of its way to rub that mess in our faces I will shop elsewhere.
Kevin,
I have absolutely no problem with your stance. I think it would be a little more meaningful if you wrote a letter or joined a group that is also protesting the company because of the commercial. It is not much of a protest if the company is not informed that you are actually shopping elsewhere. For all they know, sales are just down for a given time.
Michael’s last blog post..Ecclesiastes Chapters 3 - 5 : Turn, Turn, Turn
So, Michael, following your philosophy and your reply to Kevin, when did Jesus begin a letter writing campaign? I’ll admit, His disciples wrote about His life, but He never did. Jesus simply spoke and took a stand against people living in opposition to God’s Word. I don’t see where He was concerned about sales being down or the company being notified of something. Taking a stand, public or private, is a believer’s right, privilege, and obligation. I’m sure this ketchup company will not be hurt if I write them or if I take a private stand. But, I know I will be more in line with God’s Word and His will by taking a stand.
M. Steve Heartsill’s last blog post..Unappreciated Police Help
What about all the straight, proper, godly, holy brothers and sisters in Christ (you know, the ones whose every sin has been confessed, and whose sins aren’t nearly as bad as everyone else’s) who have been led to their jobs at Heinz as a means of supporting their families?
Yes I’m just being sarcastic but sometimes I wonder if we really think things all the way through, and make judgments based upon only a few factors that seem big in our eyes but yet leave out a lot of other details.
What party did Jesus ever participate in, what group of sinners did Jesus ever come across, what meal did Jesus ever partake in, in which He found out that their actions were simply unacceptable to God and He boycotted them? Did Jesus treat sin and sinners the same way we do? Is there not a way that we can deal with sin in this world by looking past the actions and into the hearts of people instead?
Joel Brueseke’s last blog post..Alive
Kevin,
How far you willing to take that stance? Did you boycott Disney? I’m just curious… Sometimes I wonder if reaction works as well as Godly response.
Just a thought…
Well, they’ve pulled the ad, so apparently public pressure worked in this case.
Kevin, I have to disagree with your reading of history. The great empires in history have declined because they overextended themselves with military campaigns beyond their capacities and spending habits that weren’t within their means. Societal decadance seems to go along with those behaviors, but they’re not the reasons governments fall.
Texas in Africa’s last blog post..edwards for vp? update
In defense of Kevin, I think the Bible does have examples of cities/nations being destroyed because of their social nature.
That being said, I’m still eating my Heinz. I don’t think God will judge me on my ketchup choice.
Michael’s last blog post..Ecclesiastes Chapters 3 - 5 : Turn, Turn, Turn
1st I never called for a boycott. I don’t like boycotts.. I did not boycott Disney because I like ESPN. I just said I wouldn’t use Heinz. How is that being unGodly? I won’t ask at a rest. if they are serving Heinz.
I believe people during the Civil Rights era used boycotts. Were they unGodly? So are you saying that Jesus would have just ignored sinful behavior? I don’t think so. He said go sin no more. I recognize a company can do what they want in advertising. I can vote with my $. Again I’m not calling for a large scale boycott. But if we just ignore stuff it will only continue. Obviously enough complaints pulled it in the UK. I wouldn’t want my kids seeing that especially because it was funny. That is the creepy way stuff becomes acceptable.
Seriously if I’m being unGodly then show me from Scripture & I will repent.
Kevin,
If your comments were directed to me…. I don’t believe I said you were being ungodly… I just wondered if that was the best way to handle something. Reaction versus response. I’m not criticizing or coming down on you… and I am certainly not calling you ungodly… I like you… and believe you are a Godly man. Just trying to give you something to think about. Your reaction… I’m just not going to eat Heinz again will probably never even hit their radar… but a letter explaining your feelings… no threats… but calling for them to remember their consumers could be highly offended by their ad… I was… that might be more helpful. Again, just a thought.
Robert,
Good advice. I think I will do that.
Hi all,
I’m just trying to give a different picture of how to deal with sin than what I normally see in this new covenant age in which we live.
Can you picture the woman, and her life history, to whom Jesus said “go and sin no more?” Can you imagine what kind of life she might have had. Can you look beyond her sin and get into her heart?
Can you see that Jesus said sooooo much more to her than “go and sin no more?” People were ready to condemn her. To throw her out with the rest of the sinners. To treat her exactly as the law said to do. To kill her. Much worse than not buying her product, I admit.
But the point is that while everyone else was judging the woman’s sin, Jesus looked at her and saw something that no one else was willing to see. A human being who had fallen short just like every single person in human history. A human being who had indeed just committed an act for which God’s Law said to kill her.
He didn’t ignore her sin. He dealt with it in a much different way than I see Christians today dealing with sin. That’s all I’m saying. He invited her in to a life of mercy and grace that she had probably never known! I wonder if anyone had ever told her about how God’s mercies are new every morning and how the Lord is “slow to anger and abundant in lovingkindness.” To all the self-righteous hypocrites around her, she was going to get what she deserved. But to Jesus she was going to get what the Lord really wanted to give her.
So many people see “go and sin no more” as a command meaning “you’d better not do this anymore.” But given the context of Jesus just having showered the woman with God’s grace and mercy, does anyone else not see “go and sin no more” as an invitation to walk in the lovingkindness of God in a way that the woman had possibly never known?
God, under the Old Covenant, sure did work in a way towards nations and cities that we simply don’t see today under the New Covenant. This is an age of redemption, not judgment towards sin.
Heb 9:15
And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.
I’m just asking… how does not using a product that is made by people who had a commercial with gay lovers in it, forward the message of the gospel / new covenant?
Sure the company caved to the pressure of the public (many of whom I would bet included non-Christians). What does that prove? And exactly how does that advance the good news of the new covenant in which God says “For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their lawless deeds I will remember no more?”
I’ll add another 2¢ by saying that we in the modern western church have changed the gospel to a gospel of family values. Not that many of the things the church supports are “bad” - not by any means! But the “good news” is not that nations stand because families are strong. The good news is that anyone who has committed any sin (all of us) can be restored to peace with God - to union with God - to 100% right standing with God - to intimacy with God - not because they’ve crossed all their t’s and dotted all their i’s, but because they’ve believed in the Restorer, the Messiah, the One who comes to dwell in Him, not because they’ve been able to stop sinning but because He loves them and because in His lovingkindness He has unlimited grace and in His mercy He forgives all their sin.
Joel Brueseke’s last blog post..Alive
Joel,
I agree about individuals. But this is a giant company. The only thing they care about is $.
A giant company is made up of a lot of individuals. Has the forest made it so we can’t see the trees?
Joel Brueseke’s last blog post..Moral police
Joel,
Does sin bother you? Grace isn’t a license to continue to sin. I’m all about the Grace message and it has changed my life. But God’s Grace wasn’t cheap. It cost Jesus His life.
Are we just to ignore sins and say it is OK because of God’s Grace? Do you want children being exposed to this stuff? I don’t see how saying I will buy another product is not showing the love of Jesus.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..I just used my last squirt of Heinz
As I said before, I’m not talking about ignoring sin. I’m talking about a whole ‘nother way of dealing with it.
I wonder if there were any children around when the woman was caught in adultery. I wonder if Jesus worried about how they would perceive the different way in which He handled things.
Joel,
I guess I don’t get it.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..I just used my last squirt of Heinz
I have no intentions of plugging my own blog here, but I invite you to read a post of mine from last Friday called What would you say…
And not so much my own words in the blog, but the comments left by others, particularly towards the end, from Vanessa and Kathryn. I don’t personally think it’s revolutionary thinking, but I think they really hit on the difference between how so many in the church react to sin vs. how Jesus did.
I don’t claim to have the “final answer” in any of this.
It’s just that as I’ve looked at my own life and my own sin, I’ve seen God treat me more in the way that I’m talking about (and I think the new covenant really makes the case) than how I’ve seen the church treat sin.
Joel,
I agree with what you said in that post. I’m never for condemning a person. That is the job of the Holy Spirit. But what would you have done during the Civil Rights movement? Would you just say that the good old boys should just sin no more? What if someone is a murderer? Do we just say go and sin no more? There have to be consequences for our actions.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..I just used my last squirt of Heinz
Just thinking out loud here, but perhaps take more of a look at how Jesus reacted to sin. Must there be a consequence for our actions?
The woman at the well is a great example. Jesus revealed to her what she was doing, but the conversation wasn’t about her sin. What really strikes me about that encounter is what Jesus didn’t say. In the end it had nothing to do with her sin. He talked about worship and about living water, and about how God is Spirit. He revealed to her that He was the Messiah!
As far as “go and sin no more” and the Civil Rights movement and murder… my point is that simply saying “go and sin no more” does absolutely nothing! We can certainly set up rules and laws and we can get people to change their behavior for fear of getting punished through the law (or we can write letters to companies to try to get them to stop what they’re doing), but the only thing that makes a racist or a murderer or any kind of immoral person into a soft-hearted, loving, kind person, is grace and the kindness of God, not punishment or fear.
I do think natural consequences can often make a person think twice about continuing in their ways, but again I think the only thing that really renews a person from the inside out is grace. And I think that’s what really matters.
I do appreciate this virtual ‘real time’ conversation, but I must be getting to bed. God bless you, and thanks for taking the time with me.
Sure thing Joel.
I’m having a hard time sleeping lately. Have a great day.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..I just used my last squirt of Heinz
Kevin
I saw the advert and i thought it was rather funny. I am pretty sure it was meant to be a tongue in cheek reference to a mother’s role as cook, cleaner, chauffeur, child care porvider, etc, etc - and in the end just wasn’t well handled. I DO NOT think it was designed as any statement on gay relationships.
They have cancelled the advert because people did not get the joke and that seems a reasonable end to it all. Clearly even British people don’t get British humour all the time!
Kevin,
I agree with your take on this, but isn’t this also another example in a long line of a bad witness from Southern Baptists of being known for what we are against instead of being known for what we are for?
Use mustard instead…
Or Barbeque sauce.
Phil Hoover’s last blog post..National Issue # 7: DEFICIT/DEBT REDUCTION
Rob D,
I agree it was funny but that is part of the problem. There are a lot of things that are funny to desensitize us.
Rob S,
I agree with you. I’m now for Del Monte.
Phil,
Only if it is Eastern Carolina BBQ or North Alabama White sauce.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..20 Years…
Well I first thought this was going to be about the tomato shortage till I saw the “homosexuality” topic code.
You are right that the simple way of making the couple seem normal is through humor like this. If the kiss hadn’t been included, would it have been so offensive to people? I worry at quick reactions seeming like a lack of concern for people. Only because I’ve read this blog for so long do I know that it isn’t your intention for the homosexual to not believe you care.
don’t know if i’d want to tell a child that we aren’t using Heinz ketchup because of a couple kissing on a commercial (although they weren’t using ketchup). Thankfully I’m not a parent with that task.
Hmm, just checking in today…. Heinz canceling the ad didn’t change your mind eh?
I do always appreciate honest dialog. I guess I’ve come to a place in which I’m trying to look at Christ in me, and not focus my attention on my perceptions of the problems of the world. It’s my honest perception that Jesus is not running around all worried about the state of the world, but rather He is building His church. His actual church is strong, and sturdy, and nothing can stand against it. Imagine if every person in the world only sinned once. That’s 6 billion current sins that the Lord would have to deal with. But he dealt with billions and trillions more, and His church is still strong and sturdy! My main point here… I don’t personally think He’s called us to a fear of what has been common to man ever since the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. He’s rather called us, as I understand it, to look to Him and to spread the message of reconciliation - that in Christ God was reconciling people to Himself. I’m not saying “ignore sin.” I’m just saying that in the larger picture we have a much more glorious ministry than a constant fear of sin, and to continuously go around pointing it out. Sinners sin. They always have and they always will! The ministry of the law was to point that out. But the ministry of Jesus is reconciliation. Anyway, I’ve taken enough of your time on this. I pray for completely restful nights for you.
Joel Brueseke’s last blog post..Too many rules! Vinnie Barbarino is so confused!
Joel,
I think a lot of this has to do with “Spiritual Gifts.” I have the gift of “Prophecy” so it is in my nature to be disturbed and point out sin.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..What kind of background checks do they do in Florida?
I guess I could understand what you’re saying in the context of an Old Covenant prophet, even all the way up till John the Baptist (Matt 11:13), but I’m not so sure that makes sense to me in a New Covenant context.
I’m sincerely wondering what it is about the gift of prophecy in Christ’s church that has to do with being concerned with the sins the world commits? I don’t see it, and if you have a revelation I’d be interested in it.
When Jesus sat down and had fellowship with tax collectors and sinners, was it for the purpose of being concerned with protecting His church from these people or was it to invite them into His kingdom, when others had rejected them?
The New Covenant gift of prophecy… is it really meant as a means of pointing out the sins of the world? Was that not the purpose of the Old Covenant law and prophets? Is not the New Covenant, along with all the gifts of the Spirit, a different ministry?
If Jesus is the Lamb of God, who ‘takes away’ the sin of the world, is not the “edification, exhortation and comfort” (1 Cor 14:3) that God gives us through those who prophesy based upon this wonderful new covenant, and not the old? If the blood of bulls and goats could not take away sins (Heb 10:4), but Jesus came to do just that, don’t we New Covenant prophets have a better ministry than pointing out sins? I don’t mean to harangue you.
These are all questions I’ve had to ask and answer myself.
Sin in this world is a given. Reconciliation (God reconciling people to Himself) through grace is the message the world doesn’t get and it desperately needs to hear. Not only that, it’s the message the church desperately needs!
Joel Brueseke’s last blog post..Too many rules! Vinnie Barbarino is so confused!
Joel,
Are you saying we never mention sin? This is way beyond my imagination.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..What kind of background checks do they do in Florida?
I’ve mentioned several times in comments on your blog that of course I’m not saying that we ignore sin or never mention it.
What I am saying is that the Old Covenant law was a ministry of death and condemnation. It’s the ministry that pointed out sin and convicted everyone in the world of sin. It did its job, and then Christ came along and took the sin of the world upon Himself, and now our ministry is different.
As ministers of the New Covenant, I believe our job is not to continue the Old Covenant ministry, but to press full force ahead with the New Covenant ministry of reconciliation.
Indeed Paul said things such as “How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it” and “Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body.” Those are indeed necessary exhortations within the body of Christ.
But if we look at the big picture, I think the overall message that the church should be bringing to the world, and encouraging one another with, is the message of grace and righteousness by faith. The message that we are God’s workmanship (not our own workmanship).
I guess that as I look around the Christian world, I see people who seem obsessed with sin! I seem them pointing out problem after problem after problem in the world, and I think to myself, the problem is far and wide and is well known to just about everybody! What good does spotlighting it do? Does it really help to grow the Kingdom?
And more importantly, where is the grace? Where is the message of God’s peace towards those who simply come to Him by faith? Where is the message that Jesus is building His church and we need not fear because He Himself said that the gates of Hades will not stand against it.
As for sin, where is the message that “sin shall not have dominion over you, because you are not under law, but under grace?” (Rom 6:14). Do most people in the church even understand that grace is what keeps us from being under the bondage of sin? A focus on sin does not keep us from the bondage of sin!
As I read the New Testament, I see Paul and others mentioning sin a lot. But as I look closer, most of the instances are not about pointing out sins, but rather pointing out how God has dealt with it through the cross (not through us being cross about it)!
I think sin is definitely an issue in the world today, but as I see it, God deals with it in an entirely different way than the way in which I see the church dealing with it today. I’m just sharing my thoughts with you, brother. As I said, I love honest dialog.
Joel Brueseke’s last blog post..Too many rules! Vinnie Barbarino is so confused!
Joel,
I too love honest dialog. If I am in error I sure want to know.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..What kind of background checks do they do in Florida?
Just out of curiosity…. where do you get the idea that being disturbed about sin has anything to to do with your prophetic gift? Speaking from a new testament perspective… I realize that the old testament prophets were all about this… but the Holy Spirit had not been given to convict of us of sin. So, what in the new testament connects being disturbed about sin and prophesy? Not being argumentative… just trying to understand. And no fair saying because Keith Green was angry all the time.
Robert,
I am open to correction-really. This whole Grace living is new. I grew up SBC full of condemnation & rules. I have taken Spiritual gifts Inventories & I scored high in Prophecy. My blog is about my struggles recovering from leagalism. Obviously I have a long way to go.
Kevin,
I think you’re great! Love your blog. I’m definitely not trying to correct you… Always trying to grow myself… I definitely would qualify as a high grace person… but I don’t shy away from addressing sin and confronting it head on… In a Galatians 6:1 manner. According to spiritual gift inventories I have taken, my three top gifts are leadership, evangelism, and the prophetic. And they seem to jump around in order depending on the version of test I am taking. I have carefully tried to steer away from the angry prophet thing and have leaned toward steering people toward God’s desired plan for their future. Again… I was joining the conversation and hopefully didn’t offend you.
Perhaps the whole “iron sharpens iron” thing might be a bit cliché, but yet I think it fits here and always holds a lot of truth when people come together to simply talk about things in a civilized way, family member to family member. It’s not a matter of right vs. wrong, but rather building one another up. What I mean is, we can all learn from one another. I think sometimes I get carried away in my passion, and I’m sorry if I’ve offended you in any way, Kevin. I get excited when I talk about certain things! In my heart I’m always hoping the person on the other end will see my heart but yet I know sometimes I do come across too strong.
Anyway I think we all have a long way to go! But that’s the beauty of growing in what God teaches us… He’s faithful and He moves us along in His timing. We’re never going to understand it all in this lifetime.
On the prophecy thing… some of the inventories define it differently, and I ’score’ differently according to different tests. But what I think I’ve come to see is that if we simply abide in Christ, moment by moment, it’s not as if we have to necessarily have a definition for any given gift that we may be walking in. We just simply do what we see Christ doing as He resides in us, and understand it’s Him doing the work and we rest in Him. Just my current thoughts on this.
Joel Brueseke’s last blog post..Too many rules! Vinnie Barbarino is so confused!
Joel and Robert,
You both give me a lot to think about and no I’m not offended. I really want to learn and I’ve already learned from both of you.
Kevin Bussey’s last blog post..Amish feel gas price sting too–Really!