May 17 2007
Does the law apply to Planned Parenthood?
[From Christian Post]
Planned Parenthood, the leading provider of surgical abortions, has threatened to file a lawsuit against an 18-year-old student journalist at the University of California, Los Angeles (UCLA).
Lilia Rose, who is the student editor and founder of the student pro-life magazine The Advocate, was contacted by the pro-choice organization after she recorded herself going into a clinic in Santa Monica, Calif., posing as a 15-year-old pregnant girl. She went in for an âabortionâ with a man named James OâKeefe, who acted as her 23-year-old boyfriend, which would be considered statutory rape.
The tapes reveal that she was advised by employees to invent a birthday, so she did not appear to be 15, making her situation legal. A letter from Planned Parenthood expressed to her that she had no right to tape the incident, and that she did so without their consent.
Life Dynamics, a Texas-based non-profit organization, hired an actress to make approximately 800 phone calls to abortion facilities across several states, acting as a 13-year-old girl. (Watch">Watch" />the video above) She described herself as a victim of sexual assault, but 91 percent of the locations that admitted the action was a crime agreed to conceal it.
Read about it here.
[From me]
I guess the law doesn">Watch">Watch" />the video above) She described herself as a victim of sexual assault, but 91 percent of the locations that admitted the action was a crime agreed to conceal it.
Read about it here.
[From me]
I guess the law doesn" />#8217;t apply to Planned Parenthood. Sad, millions of innocent babies are killed every year.
What do you think?
![[del.icio.us]](http://images.del.icio.us/static/img/delicious.small.gif){kind=small}
24 responses so far
Does the law apply to Planned Parenthood?
I think its good that someone is trying to keep them honest. I think its the first time I’ve seen something constructive come of the conflict. Its a shame that its politically motivated stunt instead of an unbiased health control, because I can’t really evaluate the results they’re claiming (how many times did they try it? Are they only reporting the most successful actresses? etc) but I think it’ll have the effect of making clinics stay closer to the letter of the law.
I’m not sure it should be the duty of health care professionals to report crimes. There should be no strings attached to health care. Eg, you don’t want someone deciding not to go to the hospital for injuries that someone inflicted on them out of fear that it will cause them further conflict and injury. It might sound like a rational decision, but I think it’s one that is often taken.
Some glitch made it where I couldn’t watch the video.
Abortion is murder. No disputing the fact.
But just to be clear about the “crime,” do you think a 13 y.o. girl is compelled to admit that she was victimized sexually to authorities? Or were you speaking about concealing that it was a 13 y.o. speaking to an abortion provider?
Thanks for the YouTube video. I’d seen the website and transcripts and such, but that makes it easier to share.
Planned Parenthood breaks the law on a regular basis and hides RAPE. 22 yr. olds with 13 yr. olds??!! I wouldn’t let a 22 yr. old near my teenaged daughters. The law is there to protect these girls, but Planned Parenthood thinks they know better.
And let’s not forgot PP’s sickening teen websites and defective condoms, among other things.
Dozer, we’re discussing the law. Abortion is not murder in that context. If you wish to discuss morality or ethics instead of the law, that’s fine too, but its never productive to confuse the two. Morality comes from one’s own council, and so is relative. Law comes from community consensus, and so in any specific context is absolute (ideally…). Morality and law are frequently in conflict.
PP’s legal charter requires many things of them that I do not think their morals would. IMHO, they see their mandate as one of public health, and their first responsibility to the mother. Perhaps it is always in the best interest of the mother to have crimes reported despite her wishes, perhaps it is not. It is a judgement call, and one they have to make with very imperfect knowledge. It is not their job to enforce the law, but rather to minimize harm. It is not the job of the law to minimize harm, it exists to impose order. From a moral point of view, I can understand them deciding it is better to err in favour of the mother’s wishes when a conflict may exist rather than to the letter of the law.
I’m not defending the specific actions of anyone in the video (which I haven’t viewed), I’m just considering the general case.
“Iâm not sure it should be the duty of health care professionals to report crimes. There should be no strings attached to health care. Eg, you donât want someone deciding not to go to the hospital for injuries that someone inflicted on them out of fear that it will cause them further conflict and injury. It might sound like a rational decision, but I think itâs one that is often taken.”
Too late since they already report victims of stabbings, gun shots, domestic violence, etc.
Yeah, I said “should”. But I’m not completely sure about my position. There are very good reasons for reporting those things. I think there is a conflict between the vocation of medicine and law enforcement. It is a violation of the doctor-patient confidentiality and so I see parallels, for example, to counseling and confessions.
It’s hard to say what the criteria should be for deciding whether a crime is serious enough to merit that violation. From the vocational point of view, confidentiality should be perfect. From the point of view of law enforcement, there should be no privacy at all. I tend to think medicine is more important than law enforcement, but I see that the best situation would be a compromise of some sort.
Are there things that a religious adviser is bound by law to report to police?
Geekwad,
Yes there are things that we have to report. If someone told me that they wanted to commit murder, commit suicide or they were sexually abused (a minor) I would have to report it.
Re: patient-doctor confidentiality.
The principle in mental health is one of informed consent. The idea is that the patient is completely informed of the laws and limits of confidentiality, understands it all, and is mature enough to understand the consequences of her actions.
Reporting laws (i.e. the reporting of molestation/child abuse) are based on the assumption a 13-year-old is not capable of making a mature decision about what is actually in her best interest. In Oklahoma, all adults - not just certain professionals - are required to report child abuse. The only exception is if reporting conflicts with an attorney’s client-attorney priveledge.
Kevin, how do you feel about those requirements? I expect they rarely become an issue for you, but I wonder if you’ve thought about it. Do you think you could ever find yourself in a conflict between what you thought was legal and moral because of them?
I am surprised by the results, 91% agreeing to conceal a crime. I wish they had hired an uninvolved third party to conduct it and had them release the results directly. I would like to see PP’s response, maybe I’ll hunt it up tonight.
The people at UCLA’s “The Advocate” are awesome. They also went undercover to the health clinics at UCLA, posing as pregnant students. They were encouraged to get abortions, told that there were no resources for pregnant and parenting students, and referred to one of two abortionists on staff.
If you don’t mind, I’m going to link to this on my post re: how abortion exploits women.
Bowden,
Thanks for your insight. You know the laws better than me.
theobromophile,
Thanks for stopping by and your link.
Geekwad,
I have no problem with those requirements. My concern is one day that my faith will come in conflict with the law. Then I will have to obey the Bible over the law. The law is man-made. The Bible is God’s Word and I must follow it.
[...] at Confessions of a Recovering Pharisee has a great post about how 91% of PP clinics agreed to conceal statutory rape, despite mandatory reporting [...]
This is so disgusting to me!! What’s even worse, some of the taxes I pay go to fund these murderers!
How have we come to this?????????????
Remember this post next January-March and possibly November ‘08 before casting a vote for America’s Mayor.
In his defense, Planned Parenthood doesn’t just perform abortions. Rudy would likely argue that Planned Parenthood does as much or more than any other organization in preventing unwanted pregnancies.
That said, most of us Democrats (elected officials included) don’t give a dime to PP and never will.
Bowden has hit it on the head: by law, in most states I believe, a 13 year old does not have informed consent. She could not consent to have an operation performed in any other circumstance, and could certainly not consent to not reporting a crime. Even if she confesses undying love for her 23 year old boyfriend, he should be reported. She is not mature enough to make those kind of decisions. Come on, she could not even have her appendix out without a parent’s consent(unless it’s a medical emergency and they can’t wait), but she can have an unwanted pregnancy removed? THAT should be ridiculous, whether you are pro-life or pro-choice.
In Christ,
Tim Cook
Big Daddy Weave, you’re a democrat???? I just had a GREAT laugh because you came to sing last summer at one of the MOST ULTRA CONSERVATIVE (republican and proud of it) churches, I would dare say, in America!!!!!!! I’m NOT saying you are not conservative! You would just have to know the pastor of this church. Hahahahehehe!!!!!!
Enjoyed your concert, BTW, even though I’m over 40!
I want to thank Planned Parenthood of Los Angeles for stopping by my site. I see through my stat counter that you have been on here and welcome your thoughts.
Marie,
That is not Big Daddy Weave the group. They live in Mobile, AL.
Oh, foot in mouth! Thank you Kevin!
I have a problem in identifying a church as republican . . . that’s not what the church is about.
Belinda, you are right! That is not what church is about! The church I was talking about doesn’t claim out-loud that it is affiliated with any political party, however, when voting time comes you are urged to vote for those espousing certain issues.
I thought you were supposed to be in the world, but not of it.
Amen Francoise!
“Abortion is not murder in that context.”
Depends on the state. California law defines it as homocide but provides an exception for abortion.